Hydration - How much is too much?

I do as Wendy does. I found

I do as Wendy does. I found it a lot better to swish the water around in my mouth quite a lot before finally swallowing. I realised a lot of my being "thirsty" was just dry mouth, but taking care of that made me realize later on when I was truly thirsty. I always take iced water with me, but by the time I need it it is always warm. Oh well. That's what I get for living in the desert.

John T.

Lava, you jerk. i haven't

Lava, you jerk. i haven't been able to lose any weight for months and here you lose an average of four pounds per run? i don't like you. man. do you gain it back? is it just water weight then? wow. amazing.

i would say just drink what you need. everyone is different so listen to your body, not what someone else is doing. unless you want to experiment. i have run for an hour and a half without any water. i drink a lot beforehand and i drink a liter when i finish. if what Jimmy is saying is true then maybe i will look for some hand held or camel back for long runs like that. i have been finishing my longer runs a little weak unlike before.

i also drink my water room temp. i got used to it when i lived in Mexico. can't stand ice water now, but an ice cold beer is good. i believe the Chinese say its a shock to the system to drink something cold and we should never do it. they have long experience with the body, better than modern science so to this i listen. except for that cold beer.



Mike

Ya, the weight always comes

Ya, the weight always comes back. I tend to eat like shit so I can't lose weight either. Even running 30-40 per week.

I am going to try a run to work next week. Cooler in the AM and preobably make everything easier. Start at 4AM, get to the gym accross the street at around 7-7:30. Grab a bit and still be to work earleir than I usually show up. Downside is sitting all day after a run but honestly, I felt like a million bucks after my run home.

Mike, I was told as a child

Mike, I was told as a child by my grandmother to never drink ice cold anything because it upsets the balance of yin and yang. I maintain that as much as I can (what can I say, I was 8 and it's just ingrained now), although agree that cold beer after a long run on a hot day is amazing and I don't really even like beer!

I generally don't like to carry anything on a long run so have trained myself to go up to 13 miles without during cold days, and up to 9 miles on summer mornings. But my hands swell so much in the heat that it's just not comfortable to run after about 6 or 7- no matter how much water I drink. Also, like others have said, I get terrible sideaches if anything at all is sloshing around while I run. Peppermint gum keeps my mouth from getting dry.

I NEED water for anything

I NEED water for anything longer than 5 miles when it is hot. I can really feel myself getting drained and feel better in minutes after I drink. I sweat a lot!!

Weighed myself in the buff before and after a few times and had lost 2-3 lbs. I only weigh 120 so that is a lot for me.

Today I ran 9.13 in the heat. I drank a glass of water before, drank 8oz at 3 miles, 8 oz at 5 miles and stopped to refill at a business. There I drank another 8oz and another 8oz at 8 miles. Drank another 16 when I got home!

I was so dry I didn't need to urinate at all and my body just sucked it right up, no gurgling either.

I also ate half a bread and jam sandwich at 3miles.



Peanut

LR, I'm still smiling about

LR, I'm still smiling about your OP, and your coworker's shock. It's as though she was suprised that you weren't actually dead. I've read about people drinking so much that the got dihydrous oxide toxicity and died, but you're paying pretty good attn to your systems and don't sound anywhere near dead.

Where was teh pic taken? I used to take care of some folk's properties in Potomac that backed on the C&O. A lovely trail as I recall, though I wasn't running much at all in those days.

Good luck building up for your long races. Enjoy!

Joseph, that picture was

Joseph, that picture was about mile marker 30, 7 miles north of rileys lock.

I love running the canal. Flat as a pancake and water along the ay every 8 miles or so.

A guy was killed there last week riding a bike just a mile north of that photo. I tree fell in a storm and crished him. I'd say that it was his time, what are the odds?

My new favorite and challenging trails are the Greenway. Lots of singletrack and hills. The 50 miler is on the Greenway so I want to know the trail like the back of my hand. Know when to let up and when I can crunch it. I'll post some pictures after I blog it so I can link to them.

Lava, alright if you're

Lava, alright if you're gaining it all back. if not i was going to rally all the women to vote you off the island. i run and lift weights and am just not losing. i eat a lot though, usually good but not always. plus i drink. not a lot but its enough.

i tried upping my mileage and intensity and did tmts. taking some rest but i just remembered i have some rollerblades i can use to keep up the cardio.



Mike

Mike, losing weght is tough

Mike, losing weght is tough and I am convinced it is diet more than work. If I go into a No Running phase, I pile on the lbs meaning I eat too damn much. I guess I am the saying, "I run to eat"

Lava try pre cooling before

Lava try pre cooling before your run if you can. I like frozen popsicles or slushes because there isn't anything in them other than some frozen water and sugar. You'll burn the sugar off on a run that long and studies have shown people to be able to run up to 20% longer if they get the core temp down before activity. The studies also showed that ice form seemed to work better than just drinking cold fluids. I have also been playing with ice packs on my torso before my runs to get my core temp down and it has been amazing. I run easier and longer when I pre cool than when I don't.

The idea of precooling sounds

The idea of precooling sounds interesting. I will try it myself as I get so overheated so quickly.

Gotta try that!John T. 

Gotta try that!

John T.

Reading this thread makes me

Reading this thread makes me happy that they haven't invented heat over here yet.

Thanks, Jimmy!  My wife has a

Thanks, Jimmy! My wife has a lot of trouble with overheating, even in as short as a mile and a half of a 5k run. What do you think of a camel pack full of ice water on her back? She doesn't usually drink a lot, just takes water to pour on her to cool her off.

Since Lava asked, "Sweat like a Pig" doesn't actually refer to the animal, but the iron smelting process. Most mamals sweat, but only through their paws and have to pant to keep cool. Horses sweat, but still need to breathe to stay cool. Pigs don't sweat and no other mamal on the planet sweats anywhere near as much as we do, because this is how we maintain body temp.
[*]"Sweating like a Pig" to denote sweating profusely. This sounds illogical, as pigs have ineffective sweat glands, but the term is derived from the iron smelting process. After pouring into runners in sand, it is allowed to cool and is seen as resembling a sow and piglets - Hence "pig iron". As the pigs cool, the surrounding air reaches its dew point, and beads of moisture form on the surface of the pigs. "Sweating like a pig" indicates that the pig has cooled enough to be moved in safety.
I too, sweat like a pig! I read somewhere, when you participate in sports or work out a lot, your body will increase the amount of sweat you produce and will actually start sweating sooner from conditioning...like it knows once you start moving, it's gonna be a while.

I've heard and read that pre-hydration is important and that you should drink before you get thirsty. I don't know if it would aid in pre-hydration or staying hydrated longer, but Creatine causes the muscles to retain water. I wonder if anyone has studied this effect on dyrating or staying hydrated...

I posted about my experiment with chia seeds in my last race. It was only a 5k, but I still usually feel the desire and need to drink 6-10oz of water due to the heat and humidity here in Texas, depending on the time of day. This time, I washed 3 tbsp of chia seeds down about 30min prior to the race and drank water and gatoraid till I had to pee. This was the first time, I'd run for that long in mid 80s-90s and didn't feel thirsty, even at the end. TJ mentioned they could induce cramping, which I figure has something to do with the way they soak up water, so it would be ideal to drink enough to saturate the seeds you take in. She also mentioned unexpected poops, so DEFINITELY don't try this before you take off on a 14mile jaunt through the woods unless you take some TP! LOL! At least till you know how it affects you.

Anyone else have any experience with using Chia seeds this way?? I have no large intestine, after losing a 7yr battle with colitis, so my digestive tract has been slightly modified, and the small intestine, which now takes the place of my large, absorbs +/- 2 litres less fluid per day than normal. That may have something to do with the way I'm affected...not sure.

-Jonny

Jonny, Now i feel like an

Jonny,



Now i feel like an ass for picking on you in the chia thread. I did that first before reading this that you no longer have a large intestine. That's terrible. Sorry that had to happen. I'm now going to go bury my head in the sand and allow the kids here to hit me like a pinata.



Mike

LOL!  Man, it's not like you

LOL! Man, it's not like you were kicking puppies!

Yes, it's a horrible disease, but man have I had some laughs because of it!

True stories:

I had a Doc ask my permission to scope my throat and do a colonoscopy and if his interns could watch. Before they put the bite block thing with the hole in it in my mouth , I said, "Sure! Just do the colonoscopy last...I don't want that taste in my mouth!" One kid shot coke out his nose! It was awesome!!

Before I was going in for my first surgery, I was sitting on the side of one of those hospital beds with the wheels with my wife at the time and waiting for the Knock Out Doc. A friend I hadn't talked to in a month called and asked what I was up to. I told him about the surgery and that I was sitting in stirrups waiting for yet another doc to come look up my butt and that the metal was cold! It was a great laugh! Then they wheeled me into the room, and what was waiting for me? STIRRUPS!!! If I had anything in me, I would have peed, I was laughing so hard! Irony...my truest friend! Wish I coulda got a pic of me knocked out and legs in the air! I'd so put that on my Facebook page!!!

So after the surgery, I was in the hospital for a week and a half or something like that. Same friend, a graphic artist, brings me a card with a worm looking thing on the front. It says, "So long! Thanks for all the memories!" and it was signed "-Your Colon"! I thought I was going to shoot a staple across the room!

Another friend was there when they took the drain tube out of my abdoment. Looked like a little squeeze ball with a tube dissapearing into a pencil size hole in my side. Doc twists it loose and pulls out, I kid you not, about 3 feet of tubing!! Buddy says, "Man, I thought he was going to start you like a lawn mower!" I thought my guts were going to fall out! You ever try and laugh without using your abs? You look like you're trying to learn how to whistle and it's just not going to happen! That was me! He tries to fix it, "Man, I'm sorry...try and think of something that's not funny, like...uh...smooshed kittens!", but you know how, when you're at church and you're supposed to be quiet, only you get the giggles and EVERYTHING is funny? Yeah...it didn't help! He kicked himself out.

So don't sweat it! I don't take offense easily. ;o) Life is a good teacher...we just have to try and be good students!

-Jonny

ok cool. i've never had

ok cool. i've never had surgery so that's gotta suck, no matter what. i can laugh at myself and do so constantly. maybe one day i will post about a speech i did in my public speaking class. i wish i would taped it. it was funny. i basically gave myself an award for idiot of the year. whole class was laughing and i had the teacher doubled over.

last year my daughter did have surgery. she had to have a fallopian tube removed at the age of 12. it was a horrible experience as she was in so much pain and no one could do anything to relieve it. so after the surgery we are in her room. they only allowed her mom and i in there. we are watching tv and its a nature show. they show ducks having chicks on the side of a cliff. the only way down for the chicks is to tumble down. we were laughing so hard my daughter was screaming from the pain and laughing at the same time. we laughed so hard and her mom just sat and said "what's so funny?" she obviously got some of my sick sense of humor.



Mike

Jonny I would advise against

Jonny I would advise against the ice water in the camelbak unless it's solely for the purpose of cooling through pouring. drinking the cold stuff before the run is good but during exercise it can cause abdominal cramps because it's too stark of a contrast in temperatures.

I have a lot of years with creatine studies and everything I've witnessed and read shows an increase in hydration ability through extra water storage in the muscles but nothing conclusive as to it's effects for cooling hydration. Creatine stores extra fluid in the muscle cells and that fluid is not the same fluid that is pumped out of the sweat glands. It can however allow the muscles to perform more efficiently and have more endurance which can then be translated into less work effort on your part which could aid in keeping you hydrated. Lots of "which coulds" in there but the body is one big survival machine so everything tends to work in conjunction with everything else and although the direct result may not be there an indirect one could easily yield results.

Well I tried the Ice cold

Well I tried the Ice cold before the run. Did a Accelerade Slushie. I can't say it worked really well cause my stomach was kind of upset durring the run, or was it the plate of Nacho's I ate for lunch. It did taste pretty good with some rasberries in it. Well, anyway if peeing on a run is a good sign then I am a happy camper minus the upset stomach. I only ran 6 miles in really high heat (97) and high humidity and lost 2 lbs after downing 20 Oz Accelerade on the run. Guess that wasn't too bad.

thursday morning is suposed to be in the 60's (Woo Hoo). So I am going to run to work on a 20 mile route. I think hydration will be less a problem at those tems anyway. Leave at 4AM when it is at the coldest and just take my time.

I am kinda digging the Accelerade and the 4:1 Carbs and Protein. It seems like I really recover well after a run.

that's awesome Lava.  I will

that's awesome Lava. I will say that you may have an adjustment period with the precooling but I think the nachos might be a fair blame as well.