Warm vs Cold Weather Running Question

I've searched the forums and read where you hardy souls run in temps well-below freezing, and to you I tip my hat. I live in coastal Southern California, where we typically won't see temperatures get that cold, so when I speak of "cold weather running," understand that I mean "SoCal cold," not "Minnesota cold."

Here's my q: on Saturday morning, it was cold, as in morning temps in the 50s. Clear skies, beautiful fall day, and I had a six-mile run that was nearly effortless. The rough pavement didn't bother me in the least, and when I hit the chip-and-seal, it also barely registered a blip. One of the best barefoot runs of my young career.

Fast forward to Monday: exact same course, but I ran at mid-day and the temps were in the low 80s. I'm not much of a hot weather runner to begin with, but I was shocked to find how incredibly painful my soles were. Every bit of rough pavement was evident, and the chip-and-seal was agony. I couldn't believe the difference in the two runs. The one significant difference was, to put it succinctly, cold pavement and cold feet vs warm pavement and warm feet.

Do others find that their feet are more sensitive in warm weather than in cold? I mean, it makes sense that since cold weather tends to numb your feet, you'd feel less discomfort on rough pavement when it's cold? Or, maybe I just tried to do TMTS and paid the price on the second run. It's now Wednesday and my soles still don't feel up for running (and besides, we're having our usual October heat wave, so I swam instead).

Will there come a time when my soles won't care what the temperature of the pavement is?
 
I understand exactly what you mean Thom. My feet do the same thing. For me, I think the pavement at 80 degrees actually slightly hurts me to just stand on. Which would make my feet more sensitive even while running. Pavement at 50 degrees my feet don't hurt at all and feel just comfortable to stand. Running is very comfortable at this temp. Pavement around 35-37 degrees starts hurting again to just stand there and my feet are more sensitive to run again, but this time only till my blood gets pumping, usually within a half mile or so. I've never run colder than 30 degrees so I can't tell you anything about that.
 
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Just for the record, I can tell you that you will get used to anything given time.

Here in the Philly area we get summer temps of 35 to 37C, (mid 90's F) and it's not unusual to go well below 0C. Last Saturday's race started at 27F and it's only early October, dammit! Canadian chapter

But feet are going to object to changes and then buckle down. It's what they do. Your job is to give the adjustment time and to make allowances.

TomDavid, you just might be a wuss, though, if a range of 50F to 80F throws you. I know you can handle these range changes, fella! Stick with it!
 
I don't think of 50s as cold pavement either. Not even a little bit. Cool, maybe, especially at night. Cold, no. Not enough to reduce sensation, at least for me.

I tell you my feet do get to a point being cold and/or wet when EVERYTHING hurts, even the tiniest pebble, despite feeling like there is a loss of sensation, the pain sure registers (mid to low 40s, maybe higher if very wet)

When the pavement is too hot, so asphalt in the sun even when the air is still in the 70s, and I blister up, so ouchies galore. Air temp higher but in shade, ok fine (though that was rarely the condition when I ran this summer). One of the reasons I started wearing huaraches was for hot pavement.

When I'm tired or over it (longer runs with rough sections/gravel even in huaraches or bf), everything starts to bother my feet. That's one of the ways I know I'm tired. Every little stone stuck in my foot enrages me like I've been insulted. Every twig annoys.
So maybe your feet were just tired?
Or maybe the pavement was too hot (even if the air temp wasn't)?
 
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I don't do a lot of hot weather running (90°F+). I have discovered that when running sub-freezing temperatures if my feet become sensitive to even the smallest of irregularities, then that is the sign to throw on some minimalist footwear. It saves the feet for another day.
 
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I enjoy temps in the 50s & 60s F (10-20 C) the most for running; especially when weather is clear. The colorful trees, this time of year, are an added bonus for enjoying the outdoors.

Anyway, I too notice that warmer temperatures, especially above 80 (27 C), increase my sole sensitivity. I think it's related to friction: heat increases friction, even if you're not pushing, and the more friction you have the less comfortable your feet will be. Colder temperatures just make my feet cold, no matter how fast I run. I rarely bfr below 41 degrees (5 C), unless the sunshine has warmed the pavement.
 
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I do think there's a sweet range, maybe from 32F to 80F. When it gets down to around 20F (-6C) I have a hard time on mild chipseal, but I'm still ok on smooth (and dry) asphalt. And like YOW said, even the smallest of peebles can send a sharp shot of pain up the leg if my feet are starting to numb. I also like TTM's explanation of why feet are sensitive on hotter runs. That makes sense. I'm good up to around 90 I think, then it gets hard if I'm running for a while in an unshaded section. For me, the perfect temperature range is probably something like 40 to 60F. I guess I need to live in the Pacific Northwest.
 
There is a big difference for me. Just read my race report to see the struggles I had in the heat. No blisters, but the soles became very sensitive. I think 35 to 50 F is my sweet spot. It is not numbness though, my soles just seem to be able to handle the conditions better.
+1 with that temperature range. I like dry temps from -3C to +5C, running in those temps cause no discomfort at all. My feet tend to get on the tender side once the temperature gets over +25C.
 
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I guess I need to live in the Pacific Northwest.
Are we here in OR gonna recruit someone from another state again??? We just got St John, we have Rick coming out next year for the Hood to Coast race, plus some of you's other folks. We are going to become a bf running mecca if we keep this up! :D
 
Are we here in OR gonna recruit someone from another state again??? We just got St John, we have Rick coming out next year for the Hood to Coast race, plus some of you's other folks. We are going to become a bf running mecca if we keep this up! :D
Actually, Colorado would be my first choice, because I love mountains, and it's climate is also temperate (where most people live), but my wife wants to live close to the ocean, so I guess Portland or Seattle would be a good compromise. I definitely do not want to spend the rest of my life dealing with Minnesotan winters. I can take the cold just fine, but it's so limiting. Plus Midwestern topography is rather dull. If I do make to Portland, I trust you'll help me keep Mike and Jen in line.
 
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If I do make to Portland, I trust you'll help me keep Mike and Jen in line.
Is that even possible??? Mike right now is so busy with chiropractic school that I don't think there's much to worry about with him. Jen on the other hand... :D I guess I didn't know anyone considered CO as part of the Pacific NW. I think that is kind of that limbo land kind of like where I am from in MT in between the midwest and the Pac NW. Also, you mention mountains, do you think it's flat out here in the Portland area? It's all rolling hills and Mountains such as the Cascades, Mount Hood, Mount St Helens, Jefferson, and on and on and on. ;)
 
Is that even possible??? Mike right now is so busy with chiropractic school that I don't think there's much to worry about with him. Jen on the other hand... :D I guess I didn't know anyone considered CO as part of the Pacific NW. I think that is kind of that limbo land kind of like where I am from in MT in between the midwest and the Pac NW. Also, you mention mountains, do you think it's flat out here in the Portland area? It's all rolling hills and Mountains such as the Cascades, Mount Hood, Mount St Helens, Jefferson, and on and on and on. ;)
Just a little misunderstanding Nick. I would consider the Pacific Northwest because it's temperate, has mountains, and has a coast--all wife-pleasing qualities--but my preference would be for Colorado, which is drier and has more majestic mountains, but of course, is not in the Pacific Northwest.
 
Hi Thom!

I think you should be able to handle low-80s, mid-day with a bit more practice. Personally, I start to think about putting something on my feet if it's midday and upper 80s, but lower 80s I'll usually run bare.

As for the lower end of the temperature, I think that varies with the individual. You shouldn't run on numb feet. Running with numb feet is a bad idea. Most people seem to be able to go down to freezing comfortably. And I do mean comfortably. Everybody that I've heard about that can't go down to 40 degrees F without getting numb feet has Reynaud's syndrome. As for me, I'm comfortable down to about 26 degrees if it's completely dry, and below that, will get numb feet. I'll generally pull out the shoes when it's hovering around 35, because it's never dry here.

I really like it in the winter when it's about 38, and there's still a ton of snow around. I go bare then.
 
Moderate runs in fresh snow are a treat. I think BF Bob does huge milage in snow, but I'm not up to that yet. I really hate old snow, though. There's no joy in it when the slush has been tracked up and refrozen. Ahhh, winter!
 
Moderate runs in fresh snow are a treat. I think BF Bob does huge milage in snow, but I'm not up to that yet. I really hate old snow, though. There's no joy in it when the slush has been tracked up and refrozen. Ahhh, winter!

No, I like the packed down, slushed up, messed up snow. It's cold, but gritty, and sometimes icy. The fresh stuff is too damn cold.
 
To emphasize a point made before, I think there is huge variation in how individuals' extremities react to the cold and heat. Most of those posting on this thread are what I'd consider fairly hard-core extreme (or at least cold) weather barefoot runners. I'd hate for beginners or at least those new to running barefoot in the cold to think this group's experiences are the norm and then get discouraged if they reacted differently to the cold when barefoot.

In my first cold season of barefoot running, I ventured out regardless of the temperature or conditions, including sub-freezing temps and slushy snow. I didn't know that a "numb foot is a dumb foot" and was too stupid to figure it out after painful hot spots developed after each run. After reading this forum and others, I finally realized that I was running below my temperature threshold. At the beginning of my second cold season of barefoot running (last year), I didn't run outside for my full run unless it was at least 50 F. Otherwise, I'd run on a treadmill for most of my run, and then run the last 1/2 to 1 1/2 miles outside, no matter the temperature and conditions. My feet would definitely be numb by the end of the outdoor run. By the end of the season, I could do a full run (around 4 or 5 miles) outside down to a temp of 48 F with no hot spots. I could also run almost that long in fresh powder or packed powder snow (maybe it insulates the feet some?).

Yesterday was my first cold weather run of this season. It was 46 F (wind chill 41 F) and raining. It was below my threshold of last year, but I tried to see how far I could go. I went slower and shorter than a typical run and my feet were partially/mostly numb by the end, but I suffered no hot spots or significant irritation to my soles. So it's possible I'm slowly building resistance to the cold.

Today I played football with my kids outside in the same conditions while I wore minimal shoes. After twenty minutes, my uncovered hands were mostly numb and it usually hurt to catch the ball. I think many people (including one of my boys) react similarly to these conditions. If the hands go numb in these conditions, it's probably reasonable to expect that feet will, too.

My point is that those who can run comfortably barefoot in the cold may not be typical. Many people in this forum talk about wearing minimal shoes in the cold. (I refuse to wear any kind of shoe for running, given past injuries. Running barefoot has kept me injury free for two years.) I admire you guys who can run well in the cold and I aim to push my limits in that direction. But there is likely a big range in what people can tolerate heat- and cold-wise and the most important thing is each runner pay attention to how their own feet react, no matter what others can or can't do in similar conditions.
 
I consider myself nothing like hard core, DB. Maybe extra firm, in a pinch.

Unlike you I don't mind running in VFFs a lick. I love barefooting on those intermediate days when there's some dry, warm pavement interspersed with wet or slushy bits, and I don't mind dry cold down to 20F or so after I've worked my way down to that sort of thing with several good cold runs. But that's not what I'd call "real hardcore." (See reference to BF Bob for that kind of thing. Also, it's a good time to resuscitate the video of "the Iceman" who ran a half marathon on snow, at around 0F, above the Arctic Circle in Sweden , I think.) )

I do agree that everyone is different in their tolerance, and even one person's own range is flexible, up or down, based on lots of factors.

What each of us must do is like what you've done. Pay attention to what works and to how our feet feel when we run out toward the edges of our envelopes. Also, everybody should read up on the best techniques for meeting the cold head on. How to dress, how to warm up, how to plan the route for safety and fun. Every year I get this gut deep tingle of dread / excitement, which is better than many things I don't care to list.
 
JT,
I agree that the Swedish video is impressive, as are BF Bob's and BF Rick's cold weather exploits. By "fairly hard-core", I just meant that barefoot runners who are comfortable running at 41F are probably the minority (maybe even small minority) of barefoot runners.

It's great that people post about their achievements in this and other areas. But we shouldn't assume that these experiences reflect the norm when there are few reports of "I failed at this." For the longest time I felt like something was wrong with me or that I wasn't tough enough because of the difficulties I had running in the cold. It was only because I found a couple scattered reports of others having trouble that I realized the problem wasn't me but that the posts are probably not representative of all barefoot runners' experiences. And yes, I use all the tricks for dealing with the cold, as well as some of my own (such as wearing wool socks with no soles).

I share the excitement of the challenge. In fact, running in fresh snow has been the funnest running experience I've ever had, so I can't wait, either!