Strength Training for Singles 2014: Eight-Week Workout Cycle III

Seems ambitious to add that much weight each week, but I guess you start each cycle a lower than your actual maxes, right? It's interesting, after going light on Saturday, I did pretty well yesterday. So maybe I can just alternate easy and heavy workouts as a simple sort of wave, something we've discussed before, I think.

Yeah it is ambitious but I looked at the increasing 80% weights and it seemed reasonable. The max weight is true max. Here is the file, I guess I am using 85% and it probably is too high for the deadlift? Anyway I calculated the percentages and then pulled them down to the workout.

So this cycle I started out with
165kgs x 87% = 144kgs x 85% = 120kgs
Next cycle I will start out at
175kgs x 87% = 152kgs x 85% = 130kgs

So basically a 10kg increase in my beginning 5 rep working sets. If this one gets really tough at the end I might drop down to 80% so that will be a smaller increase.

Today I found out its not really easy but it is easier, definitely something I can do 3 times a week even feeling worn out. Or possibly in back to back workouts.

Glad you like your bar! I still look at my fancy bearing bar and laugh cause all I use it for is benching, squatting and pressing. Such a waste.
 

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Seems ambitious to add that much weight each week, but I guess you start each cycle a lower than your actual maxes, right? It's interesting, after going light on Saturday, I did pretty well yesterday. So maybe I can just alternate easy and heavy workouts as a simple sort of wave, something we've discussed before, I think.

Yeah it is ambitious but I looked at the increasing 80% weights and it seemed reasonable. The max weight is true max.

Here is the file, maybe the 85% is too high for the deadlift? Anyway I calculated the percentages and then pulled them down to the workout.
OK, I get it. But increasing by 10 pounds every week for the deadlift and 5 pounds every week for the other lifts seems insane. Are you going to juice? I see that your starting light, but you end up something like 30 pounds over your current 5RM, right?

Maybe I'm being too conservative, but I'm thinking 10 pounds per cycle is a reasonable goal. In any case, good luck. Besides the radical increases, everything else seems pretty good to me and I look forward to seeing how you progress with this version of our L'Abide protocol.

When I said 'actual' or true' maxes, I mean 3RM or 5RM as a percentage of your 1RM, but you then take a percent of those as well. In my calculations, there's no second step, so that's where the confusion lies. So if my true 1RM deadlift is 375, then, at 80%, my 5RM is 300. I don't then take take any more off that, and I'm not really sure why you do.

You may not have seen it, but I was wondering if you still intend to do the upper body pulls this cycle.

Anyway, good to see someone else chart things out so elaborately. Makes me feel a little less nerdy.

I was wondering about is the percentages too. It's possible my 5RM is no longer 80%, but closer to 85%, because after a whole cycle of doing a lot of five-rep sets, I may have not only gotten stronger, but simply better at them. So my 1RM increase might not be as much as I've calculated. In the first cycle, my five-rep sets always came after singles and triples, so perhaps 80% was all I was good for? Only way to find out for sure is to test my singles, but that will probably be a while.
 
Oh sure, Rippetoe may be an expert in many areas, but one has to consider their personal situation.

For example, Rippetoe clearly demonstrates ignorance about the biomechanics of feet and shoes. Eventually, his argument degrades to shoes as a means to contain blood, should one drop a plate on their foot. Does dropping plates happen that in his gym?!

http://startingstrength.wikia.com/wiki/Equipment
Rippetoe said:
Shoes are the only piece of personal equipment that you really need to own. It only takes one set of five in a pair of squat shoes to demonstrate convincingly to anybody who has done more than one squat workout. A good pair of squat shoes adds enough to the efficiency of the movement that the cost is easily justified. For anywhere from $50 to $200 for the newest Adidas weightlifting shoes, a pair of proper shoes makes a big difference in the way a squat feels. Powerlifting squat shoes have relatively flat soles, and Olympic weightlifting shoes have a little lift in the heel that makes it easier to get the knees forward just in front of the toes. Your choice will depend on your squatting style and your flexibility. Most squat shoes have metatarsal straps to increase lateral stability and suck the foot back into the shoe to reduce intra-shoe movement.

But the main feature of a squat shoe is heel compressibility. The drive out of the bottom starts at the floor, where the feet start the kinetic chain. If the contact between the feet and the floor is the squishy gel or air cell of a running shoe, a percentage of the force of the drive will be absorbed by the compression of the cell. This compression is fine for running, but when squatting it reduces power transmission efficiency and prevents foot stability. Unstable footing interferes with the reproducibility of the movement pattern, rendering virtually every squat a whole new experience and preventing the development of good technique. Squatting in running shoes is like squatting on a bed. Many people get away with it for years, but serious lifters invest in squat shoes. They aren't that expensive, especially compared to brand new name brand athletic shoes, and they make a huge difference in the way a squat feels.

http://startingstrength.com/resources/forum/showthread.php?t=7330
Rippetoe said:
Training barefoot is not allowed in my gym. I don't need your DNA all over the room if you stub your toe or drop a plate. The Vibram things are fine as long as they contain your fluids. But I don't see why you people are so defensive of your Right To Train Barefoot. There's a good reason why everyone that is serious about barbell training trains with both barbells and weightlifting shoes.

The stability provided by WL shoes is the major issue. They provide a non-compressible heel and side-to-side stability with the metatarsal straps. I have not seen the new Vibram strapped version, but they cannot provide the support that a WL shoes does because they lack the mass.
 
Yep sorry I did mean to respond, I will include both rows and pull ups, just not as linearly. I'll do them 2 or 3 x 5-10 and then have farmers and the ab roller. 40 minute workouts being the goal. I might even do some finishers where I do pull ups, farmers and ab rolls or something. These are easy lifts for me so I rarely will ever skip them.

Yeah I know that 's what you meant about the 3 and 5 rep max. I just know mine aren't as clear cut. After our discussions the last few weeks, I think working in the 3-5 rep range at a estimated reasonable weight might be a better option for concurrent training. That's the main reason I am doing the new calculation. My 5 rep max for the DL based on the average ExRx at 142kgs is a very close estimate I suspect.

The problem is if I use 80-85% of my 1RM numbers I will be working at 95-99% of my estimated 5RM calculation. I don't think we want to be working at this level for too long and think that might be a flaw of using a percentage of your 1RM. Does that answer your question? Or make sense?

Your 5RM might not even be the 87% ExRx estimated but its and easier number to test or reasonably estimate than guessing on the percentage I think.
 
And no juice, really when you think about it using the percentages a 10kg increase really only works out to 7kg on a 5RM basis, that over 8 weeks should be doable for 3 cycles?

DL 2x5 ------------Starting Weight - Ending Weight
165 Max Cycle 1 - 115---------------- 137.5
175 Max Cycle 2 - 120---------------- 145
185 Max Cycle 3 - 127.5-------------- 152.5

The question is can I do that progression each cycle? Maybe doing a 1.5% increase each week may be better?
 
And no juice, really when you think about it using the percentages a 10kg increase really only works out to 7kg on a 5RM basis, that over 8 weeks should be doable for 3 cycles?

DL 2x5 ------------Starting Weight - Ending Weight
165 Max Cycle 1 - 115---------------- 137.5
175 Max Cycle 2 - 120---------------- 145
185 Max Cycle 3 - 127.5-------------- 152.5

The question is can I do that progression each cycle? Maybe doing a 1.5% increase each week may be better?
OK, now I'm really confused. At the end of the last cycle, you did 2x5x140, right? That's five pounds heavier than my 5RM. Now for this cycle you're starting at 115 and ending at 137.5? Seems like you're starting way too light, but ending lower than your current capabilities. I can understand your desire to go easy so that you don't get interference with your other pursuits, and I kinda get the wave concept (but not really), but I don't see how you're going to progress this way.

I don't mean to belabor this, and please don't feel any need to explain further, but it seems that if you can already do 2x5x140, then you wouldn't want to go much lower than 10 kgs for an 'easy' training weight.

For me, I don't take the percentages that seriously. They're more a way to project between different rep counts, but I mostly go by what I'm doing in workouts. I know I can do 2x5x300, but 2x5x305 felt a little heavy on Monday, so I ended up doing 3/3/4. That tells me I need to stick to 300 for a while longer, or perhaps do paused reps at 305, or perhaps do 3/3/4 at 305 for a while and gradually get it to 2x5, which is what I'll probably do simply because it's a lot easier just to deal with three big plates. Today I feel completely recovered, so that tells me these weights, at either 2x5x300 or 3/3/4x305 are sustainable. If I start to feel worn down, or the weight feels heavier, or I'm not recovering sufficiently, then that will tell me 300-305 isn't sustainable on a 3xweek basis.

That said, there may be merit in alternating light-heavy, but the wave concept as you're deploying it over a whole cycle doesn't make sense to me. But the proof is in the pudding so it'll be interesting to see how you do with this protocol.

One thing we both seem to have adopted is doing pretty much everything as either triples or quintuples. Those rep-counts just feel really good to me. They keep you from training "on the nerve" as Thibaudeau says (http://www.t-nation.com/training/5-ways-to-stop-being-a-weakling), but seem to get pretty good results when training with higher frequency, as we are.
 
Oh sure, Rippetoe may be an expert in many areas, but one has to consider their personal situation.

For example, Rippetoe clearly demonstrates ignorance about the biomechanics of feet and shoes. Eventually, his argument degrades to shoes as a means to contain blood, should one drop a plate on their foot. Does dropping plates happen that in his gym?!

http://startingstrength.wikia.com/wiki/Equipment


http://startingstrength.com/resources/forum/showthread.php?t=7330
I don't see any ignorance, but I agree he probably hasn't considered barefeet as carefully as he might, and he evinces typical shoddy preconceptions.

Still, as you know, I'm more convinced by the practical experience of elite athletes than any study or theoretical argument. If most advanced lifters use shoes, chalk, and bare hands, it's because they've found it gives them a competitive advantage. If someone found they could lift more barefoot, and started winning contests, the idea would spread. There's not a whole lot of money in powerlifting, but there's a lot of pride, and those guys like to win.

If I were to ever develop a heavy squat, I might even consider knee wraps and wrist straps, but at my level, even a belt is probably overkill.

Anyway, I'm sincerely happy you've found something that improves the quality of your workouts.
 
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OK, now I'm really confused. At the end of the last cycle, you did 2x5x140, right? That's five pounds heavier than my 5RM. Now for this cycle you're starting at 115 and ending at 137.5? Seems like you're starting way too light, but ending lower than your current capabilities. I can understand your desire to go easy so that you don't get interference with your other pursuits, and I kinda get the wave concept (but not really), but I don't see how you're going to progress this way.

I don't mean to belabor this, and please don't feel any need to explain further, but it seems that if you can already do 2x5x140, then you wouldn't want to go much lower than 10 kgs for an 'easy' training weight.

Hey don't worry about it I like talking these things through.

My ideas changed a little bit when we started talking about the rep ranges and the issues with fatigue. I went back and read a few things from Jim Wendler, Dan John and a couple of other authors. Wendler does something similar wit using 90% of your max and then lifting from 75-90% of that. I feel like my calculation is a little more precise.

Anyway the idea is to wave up the intensity so you get to the heavy lifts but gradually and then reset and work back up. Its kind of the 2 steps forward one step back. I think this concept will fit a little better while running as I can add some long efforts and hit the lifts whenever I want and not get interference.

The 2 x 5 x 140 was pretty much my max at a 5 rep set, so 143kg is probably an accurate representation of 100% for the 5RM. If I want to logically progress I shouldn't be hitting this regularly if I am going with the logic of working in the 80% range? Here are a few quotes.

Jim Wendler:

Starting Light

While it may seem counterintuitive to take weight off the bar when the goal is to add weight to it, starting lighter allows you more room to progress forward. This is a very hard pill to swallow for most lifters. They want to start heavy and they want to start now. This is nothing more than ego, and nothing will destroy a lifter faster, or for longer, than ego.

You aren't just picking a weight to lift five times or three times or one time per set. You're using a specific percentage of your one-rep max. And not your full 1RM. The calculations are based on 90% of it.
So if your 1RM in the bench press is 315 pounds, you use 285 (90%) as the base number for your training-weight calculations.

Dan John:
1. Never miss a rep!
2. Follow the “Rule of Ten” for the appropriate lifts for an advanced lifter; if Patterning needs to be done, do it as often and as much as necessary; and, use the rules of 15-25 for the appropriate half body lifts.

So that's my reasoning? In a nutshell. The main goal is to walk in the gym get a good workout in as regularly as I can with minimal interference.

I thought a little about the PL comp, I'm not sure I can get to that level while working on a 100 miler? Although that would be really cool to get both in a year. Let me think about it a little more. My biggest worry is getting a 315 squat.
 
OK, now I'm really confused. At the end of the last cycle, you did 2x5x140, right? That's five pounds heavier than my 5RM. Now for this cycle you're starting at 115 and ending at 137.5? Seems like you're starting way too light, but ending lower than your current capabilities. I can understand your desire to go easy so that you don't get interference with your other pursuits, and I kinda get the wave concept (but not really), but I don't see how you're going to progress this way.

I don't mean to belabor this, and please don't feel any need to explain further, but it seems that if you can already do 2x5x140, then you wouldn't want to go much lower than 10 kgs for an 'easy' training weight.

Hey don't worry about it I like talking these things through.

My ideas changed a little bit when we started talking about the rep ranges and the issues with fatigue. I went back and read a few things from Jim Wendler, Dan John and a couple of other authors. Wendler does something similar wit using 90% of your max and then lifting from 75-90% of that. I feel like my calculation is a little more precise.

Anyway the idea is to wave up the intensity so you get to the heavy lifts but gradually and then reset and work back up. Its kind of the 2 steps forward one step back. I think this concept will fit a little better while running as I can add some long efforts and hit the lifts whenever I want and not get interference.

The 2 x 5 x 140 was pretty much my max at a 5 rep set, so 143kg is probably an accurate representation of 100% for the 5RM. If I want to logically progress I shouldn't be hitting this regularly if I am going with the logic of working in the 80% range? Here are a few quotes.

Jim Wendler:

Starting Light

While it may seem counterintuitive to take weight off the bar when the goal is to add weight to it, starting lighter allows you more room to progress forward. This is a very hard pill to swallow for most lifters. They want to start heavy and they want to start now. This is nothing more than ego, and nothing will destroy a lifter faster, or for longer, than ego.

You aren't just picking a weight to lift five times or three times or one time per set. You're using a specific percentage of your one-rep max. And not your full 1RM. The calculations are based on 90% of it.
So if your 1RM in the bench press is 315 pounds, you use 285 (90%) as the base number for your training-weight calculations.

Dan John:
1. Never miss a rep!
2. Follow the “Rule of Ten” for the appropriate lifts for an advanced lifter; if Patterning needs to be done, do it as often and as much as necessary; and, use the rules of 15-25 for the appropriate half body lifts.

So that's my reasoning? In a nutshell. The main goal is to walk in the gym get a good workout in as regularly as I can with minimal interference.

I thought a little about the PL comp, I'm not sure I can get to that level while working on a 100 miler? Although that would be really cool to get both in a year. Let me think about it a little more. My biggest worry is getting a 315 squat.
Thanks for taking the time to explain a bit more. I like talking these things through too, especially with someone like you who's at more or less the same level and has similar goals.

The 'wave' is an interesting, if counterintuitive concept, and it's not clear why it would work to deload so much, but I actually ended up doing something like this when I had to start all over again with both the Squat and Deadlift while rehabbing my right knee and hamstring in Cycle II. I seem to have come back stronger, despite a month or more of lifting light. Of course, I have no idea of where I'd be if I had been going strong the whole cycle, so it's hard to say, but at least now I have some sense for how it might work.

In any case, I'm not going to argue with Wendler or DJ, but others seem to get results with simpler schemes. I like some of the stuff I've been reading in Thibaudeau's articles. He seems to endorse ramping things up towards the end of a eight-week cycle too, but its more of a step than a wave pattern. I could maybe implement my 1/3/5 scheme towards the end of this cycle for a week or two before testing my 1RM. So that would be something of a cyclical wave. I dunno. Since my knee and hamstring strain, I do place a lot more emphasis on avoiding overtraining, whereas previously, it was never an issue, so I'm all for gradual, longterm results.

But I'm not training for an ultra. In fact, running has taken a back seat to lifting lately. Just running mediocre fartleks 3-6 miles, three times a week seems like it's enough right now. I especially like how fartleks kinda parallel the pacing of an ST workout, with periods of greater effort followed by easing up. Maybe I'll become a convert to interval training? And the walking breaks really seem to help me recover faster. I don't feel nearly as tight the next day.

I'm really enjoying the idea of getting stronger on some of these basic lifts despite, or because of, starting to feel the effects of age. I guess it's just a new challenge, same as running long was last year. Eventually it would be nice just to do maintenance workouts, once I get to a certain level, like the 1000-pound combo or something, and then any gains after that would be frosting on the cake, nothing that I would pursue.

In any case, you're helping me convince myself that I have to program some kind of easy-hard alternation, besides the usual autoregulation. I'm liking the idea of making Monday and Friday basic and heavy, and then make Wednesday 20-30 pounds lighter with a bunch of assistance stuff tacked on afterwards. Maybe I'll try that this week and see how it feels. I think for me, minimally, I have to do each of the six lifts with decent intensity at least once a week. Two might work, but three times is probably asking for trouble.

I'll probably shoot for the 1000-pound combo, now that I'm allowing myself to work harder on the bench press, and I'll probably only test singles on those three powerlifter lifts. Overhead press is too hard for me to do as a single. Even in five-rep set, the first rep is often the hardest. Once I can do pullups again, I'll set rep goals for those, but probably not weight goals. All the row variationss have too much room for cheating to mean much as a single, except maybe the inverted row . . .

So I guess it's strength training with something of a powerlifting emphasis, minus the powerlifting silliness. Feel free to join me in the push to 1000 whenever you feel like it, or when the ultra is out of the way. Doing an hundred miles and a thousand pounds has a nice ring to it though. Maybe you could set up a new, extreme sort of pump-n-run. Lift 1000 pounds combined in the three big lifts, then run a 100-mile ultra marathon right afterwards. The "Milli-hundo"?

Anyway, we're starting out at close to the same place on the deadlift quintuples, so it will be interesting to compare notes at the end of the cycle, having used two different approaches.

I think you'll find that once you get more comfortable with your squat, the numbers will start to go up more quickly. It's really hard to approach the bar if the lift still doesn't feel comfortable. It's a big leap of faith to put a good deal of weight on one's back and then let gravity work it's magic, counting on one's technique and strength to reverse directions and bring it back up.

My low-bar squat is starting to feel pretty automatic, but it's taken many months to get there, and I'm still not 100%, more like 95%, confident in my technique choices. I seem to attain good depth pretty automatically these days, and my knees don't seem to have any tendency to buckle anymore, even when I'm not thinking about it. And when I get a nice narrow grip, the bar on my back feels super stable, which gives me a lot of confidence too. I tried a high bar squat the other day, while warming up, and it just feels so unstable. You really have to use your arms. Whereas with low-bar squats, all the focus is on the legs, because it's almost impossible for the bar to move.
 
I call it a wave, but I'm not sure if that is the correct classification. Step ups might be better. Yeah I'm curious to see how it will work too, or if I feel any better? I lifted twice n a row and it was very manageable so I think the weight loads are right. I might hit a third day tomorrow just to see.

I'll probably keep the 1000 pounds a longer term goal but just keep working up to it. I really am not sure it would even be possible if I were to drop my weight close to 185 pounds. Who knows, its definitely a cool goal. I was reading some posts from that Alex Viada guy about some of his trainees are doing squat 500 and run under a 5 minute mile, that's pretty impressive. I think a 1000lb total and 100 miler might actually be better than that? I know someone who might let me do that challenge in 2016 at the event...

About the PL silliness, I have been trying to get back to some of the full movements for the squat and bench mainly. I think I like that process better than the shortened movement pattern PL usually encourages.

Alright I need to go update my lifts post.
 
I call it a wave, but I'm not sure if that is the correct classification. Step ups might be better. Yeah I'm curious to see how it will work too, or if I feel any better? I lifted twice n a row and it was very manageable so I think the weight loads are right. I might hit a third day tomorrow just to see.

I'll probably keep the 1000 pounds a longer term goal but just keep working up to it. I really am not sure it would even be possible if I were to drop my weight close to 185 pounds. Who knows, its definitely a cool goal. I was reading some posts from that Alex Viada guy about some of his trainees are doing squat 500 and run under a 5 minute mile, that's pretty impressive. I think a 1000lb total and 100 miler might actually be better than that? I know someone who might let me do that challenge in 2016 at the event...

About the PL silliness, I have been trying to get back to some of the full movements for the squat and bench mainly. I think I like that process better than the shortened movement pattern PL usually encourages.

Alright I need to go update my lifts post.
Well, I did a purposely light workout yesterday, partly influenced by being tired and a little short on time, but mostly because it was my intention after yesterday's exchange, and it felt pretty good. So I might go with a Heavy-Light-Heavy weekly routine and see how it feels. That way, I have either 72 or 96 hours to recover from lifting heavy. As I wrote in the log, the light day might consistent mainly of assistance exercises, or variations of the six basic lifts.

It would be awesome for you to do a milli-hundo in 2016, and you're uniquely qualified to be the man who initiates the craze. I want 10 percent of all purse winnings though, for making the suggestion.

Yep, I've become a little more familiar with the PL world over the last six months, while learning more about lifting technique and gear, and it just doesn't make sense to me to lift in such weird positions with potential longterm damage to the joints. Rippetoe talks about feeling old and beat-up, as if he'd spent a career playing football or rugby or something, and he's in his fifties still I think. Fitness is what it's all about. Strength, Mobility, & Endurance training should all lead to greater health and fitness, not less. But if you're young and have the urge to compete, and aren't athletic enough to play sports, or aren't good enough to make it to the pros, I can see how PL might appeal. I would imagine a lot of PL guys are ex-college football linemen who didn't have what it takes to take the next step up into the NFL.

In any case, I'm definitely doing the big lifts the healthiest and safest way possible, numbers are just there to quantify progress, nothing more. Plus I really like the feeling of a deeper squat and that bounce coming back up.
 
It would be awesome for you to do a milli-hundo in 2016, and you're uniquely qualified to be the man who initiate's the craze.

let us now be pedantic: wouldn't that be a "kilo-hundo" or a"kilo-hecta" or a "kill-a-hundo" or something? :) but i suppose they are millipedes and centipedes even though they have a metaphorical thousand and hundred legs rather than one one-thousandth of a leg...

i have done lighter weights days for the last two days for a variety of reasons. pullups seem really easy all of the sudden. :) and good work cranking out a few proto-pullups, bare lee. either tonight or tomorrow i'll get back to a "normal" plan, so i'll be interested to see how it feels.
 
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let us now be pedantic: wouldn't that be a "kilo-hundo" or a"kilo-hecta" or a "kill-a-hundo" or something? :) but i suppose they are millipedes and centipedes even though they have a metaphorical thousand and hundred legs rather than one one-thousandth of a leg...

i have done lighter weights days for the last two days for a variety of reasons. pullups seem really easy all of the sudden. :) and good work cranking out a few proto-pullups, bare lee. either tonight or tomorrow i'll get back to a "normal" plan, so i'll be interested to see how it feels.
I don't know why you'd prefer those variations, they're all abominations, combining either Greek or Latin roots with an Old English root. I was just going for something that went well rhythmically with the already-established "hundo."

Yah, I started doing proto-pullups last summer, but then stopped when it felt like they were irritating my shoulder. I think maybe I wasn't retracting my shoulder blades enough.

Recently my heaviest pulldown has started to pull me up from the floor, so I'm going to start integrating the assisted pullups again now I guess. I did the green bands (resistance 50-120lb) yesterday, I'll try the lighter blue band (resistance 25-80) next time. Still, it isn't as much fun doing pullups from a kneeling position. I need a taller garage.

I'm also looking to work the dips back in slowly using assistance bands, but today I do feel a little tenderness at the top of the delts, so I'm not sure that's going to be a go. Still, I used to dips all the time (albeit at a lower BW), so hopefully it's a disuse soreness and not a don't use soreness.
 
well, let's pool our funds and sponsor abide for his first half-tuh-hun-do.

and if you're starting to hover off the ground, it sounds like you're really close to elevating yourself. have you tried an unbanded pullup recently? and i thought you had a door rack thingee? of course, that might mean leaving the friendly confines of the garage...
 
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well, let's pool our funds and sponsor abide for his first half-tuh-hun-do.

and if you're starting to hover off the ground, it sounds like you're really close to elevating yourself. have you tried an unbanded pullup recently? and i thought you had a door rack thingee? of course, that might mean leaving the friendly confines of the garage...
Agreed, you pay for transportation, lodging, and food, and I'll pay for beer.

Yah, I tried a real pullup last week, and it was hard developing initial momentum, hence the idea of using the training wheels. Pulldowns don't work exactly the same muscles, I think some of the trunk gets left out, and that's probably where I'm having trouble. I'm very adverse to pulling a muscle, and I weigh 250, so it's not like other lifts where you can start light and build up to a decent weight. I think it would be a lot easier if I had a bar to jump up to, instead of grabbing the bar that's connected to my rack and lowering myself to a kneeling position on the floor. It just feels kinda awkward. Unfortunately there's no place in the house that has a high ceiling and a convenient or appropriate place to hang a bar from. I could do it outside the house, but it's cold and I'm a little self-conscious about attempting a pathetic pullup in full view of the neighbors. Right now I'm working on an idea to get the neutral handles a little higher up on the power rack by taking them off the pullup bar and attaching them directly onto the top bar of the pullup rack. I just have to cock my head a bit to the side to avoid hitting the high pulley/cable support beam. This would have the added advantage of allowing me to use the Rogue C-70 bar for squats without needing to put the collars on as spacers.

Reduced.jpg

One way or the other, I hope to soon join the pullup club. Don't want to be left behind. Seriously though, I do take mastering each of the six basic movements seriously, and I'm sure there'll be decent carryover to the other lifts. I've never taken pullups seriously though, so this might be a long term project, linked to some degree with my ability to shed a little belly flab.

Edit: timely article: http://www.t-nation.com/training/stop-sucking-at-pull-ups
 
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Thanks Sid. Unfortunately our house is a mid-century, flat-roofed house, so no attic, and the stairs are open, split in the middle by a landing by the doorway halfway between floors, so relatively shallow. The fundamental problem is that my garage ceiling is something like 85" inches high, and I'm a little less than 74". I can't do standing overhead presses either. The upstairs ceilings are a bit higher, but I'm not going to remove material to get at the joists in the living room. Outside of the garage there's a space underneath the second-story veranda/porch. That would probably work, but I'm not committing to it yet for the aforementioned issues. I think I'm probably resigned to kneeling pullups for the foreseeable future. No big deal, just a little awkward, but it can be done.
 
Lee those neutral grips seem kind of wide, any chance you can make them more narrow? I think you will find it easier. I find wide neutral grips harder than narrow normal grip.
 
Is that a half metric or American ton? I'm only agreeing to this if I have some training partners buy in.
For clarity, let's call it the "(American) Half-ton Hundo." This way we maintain a pure Old English root basis, and make it clear we're talking about 1000 pounds. A thousand pounds, a hundred miles. Older systems of measurement for the newest test of strength and endurance.

Broad Arrow and I can split training partner duties. I'll train the lifts and BA the hundo. Sid can do nutrition and research potential venues. Michael Sandler can handle promotion and PR.
Lee those neutral grips seem kind of wide, any chance you can make them more narrow? I think you will find it easier. I find wide neutral grips harder than narrow normal grip.
Yah, they're wider than my neutral grip handle attachment for pulldowns.
41OIoVKRNKL.jpg

Thanks for confirming that this might be part of the difficulty. I feel like less of a wimp now.

My idea, which I may get around to today, is to take the neutral grip handles off of the chinup bar, then take the chinup bar off the power rack, and then reattach the neutral grip handles to the top beam of the power rack, turning them 90 degrees to make the plate horizontal rather than vertical. I would put one neutral grip handle close to the leftmost post, using the hole I drilled for the chinup bar as the hole for the handle plate's innermost bolt, and drill a new hole closer to the post, and then drill two holes into the power rack beam on the other side of the high cable/pulley beam, but well short of the other vertical post of the power rack, so that my head would bop up to the left of pulley/cable beam, on the side of the first neutral grip handle.

Power rack top beam with vertical posts and center pulley beam
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Spacing of neutral grip pullup handles

So the spacing would be more like 20-22" between the handles. Do you have a recommended width in mind? I was thinking 20 inches might be good. That's the same as my dip station, and I think it's close to the official Olympic width for parallel bars.

Edit: Hmmn, here the spacing is just 16":


71HOOIcZrVL._SX522_.jpg


And I saw another with 19" spacing: http://www.ultimatebodypress.com/joist-mounted-pull-up-bar-19.html
 
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