5th Annual Winter Challenge

Interesting never heard about the petroleum jelly. I do recall Yvonne and I think someone else last year saying they use the wax on the bottom of the feet that you can get for sled dogs.

We had a giveaway for the doggy stuff a few weeks ago. We're still waiting for a review Lee?

It's the spoon I don't get? Why use a spoon not fingers? :{
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We had a giveaway for the doggy stuff a few weeks ago. We're still waiting for a review Lee?

It's the spoon I don't get? Why use a spoon not fingers? :{
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Almost a month ago Paul, and I still haven't received it.

But this discussion is intriguing, as is the question of why the topic hasn't been mentioned before. Withholding training tips for a competitive advantage?

I haven't run since we got hit by freezing snow 10 days ago. I keep blowing off my morning run, telling myself that if I run in the afternoon I might be able to get a few bare miles in, but then when it's afternoon, I don't really feel like running with all the hustle and bustle going on, as the first-thing-in-the-morning habit has apparently taken hold. I just love the dark tranquility. So I gotta stop being a baby and just get out and run shod in the cold stuff. Once I discovered the Sockwas last winter, it wasn't so bad, but I'm still a bit resentful now that carefree barefoot running might be over for me for a considerable amount of time. Gotta face up to the facts. I just don't think I'll seek out good barefoot conditions like I have the last few winters. It's more important to me to finally establish a consistent earlymorning routine.

Still, I'll try to get in a few afternoon runs on dry pavement (when it reappears) just to maintain some semblance of plantar callus. So I just ordered some
and petroleum jelly, thanks to this thread. I can hardly wait to see the reaction of my wife and daughter to me putting on a paw protector. At moments like these, my wife usually says something like, "sorry daughter, but this is the man I love, so please accept him as your father."
 
It's the spoon I don't get? Why use a spoon not fingers? :{.

the stuff goes by various names (at least in "america"): petroleum jelly, "white petrolatum", (brand name) "vasoline". whatever. it's like the super thick lotion. you can usually get it at the drug store or the drug store section of a larger store.

of course, you can use your fingers. but, i have found the spoon to be better. i guess i have skinny fingers and it is kinda like spreading butter. i know proper people would be mortified, but i find spoons with their broader business end and convexity to be better for spreading things than knives (or fingers!) are. also, you don't end up with greasy fingers when you are trying to zip up your jacket, hold your GPS, turn doorknobs, etc. :) the whole point is that it provides a non-evaporative, flexible layer that doesn't come off easily. so it is easier just to keep that on the spoon instead of myself.

so, for those who have tried wax, if you put it on the bottom does it tend to make the grit stick to your feet? (also, would that be the best-ever, super-minimalist paintable shoe? :) )
 
so, for those who have tried wax, if you put it on the bottom does it tend to make the grit stick to your feet? (also, would that be the best-ever, super-minimalist paintable shoe? :) )

I'm not sure if Yvonne is checking in here much but as I recall she described it to me as more like a lotion that gets absorbed into the skin to make it more resistant against the salt and chemicals on the road, not like a ski wax that builds up a layer on the outside.

1) prewarm the feet in a heated sand bath

That reminds me I was going to look more into the Seri Boot idea. Do you recommend it? I'm definitely interested in giving it a try but I wonder how it would effect cold tolerance. I mean its for the opposite right... a tough layer of skin that develops in response to your feet being constantly exposed to extremely hot desert sand. A tough layer is good, and I hope that would help me with doing trail running as opposed to almost exclusive asphalt running that I currently do. But does this high temperature do anything to the blood vessels or circulation? It just seems counter-intuitive to get ones feet used to cold by exposing them to heat. I was thinking it might be good to keep the feet tough in the winter when I can't run barefoot... but maybe it would help in both ways... idk
 
I have chased up the Pawtector Lee. Sorry about that.
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I have chased up the Pawtector Lee. Sorry about that.
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No problem, I had kinda forgotten about it. I should've contacted her myself.

The more I think about it though, the more I wonder if I would actually run with any of this stuff on. I mean, how do you get out the door without smearing it everywhere? And then when you get home or back to your car, you have to clean up, right? But it's definitely an intriguing idea to wear non-footwear protection against the cold. It might extend my tolerances a bit and help me get my fix of plantar stimulation. It would be really great if it protected against salt, as I intend to run down by the river a lot this winter, and they salt some stretches there.

Hopefully Yvonne and Paraganek will comment a bit more on how much it helps and their application protocols, as BA has done. For example, is it the difference between tolerating moisture or not? Or does it just offer a little extra protection against cold surfaces?
 
concerning the wax stuff and salt/chemicals: i've never had any trouble with salt or chemicals in the chemical sense of irritation or anything. mechanically, rock salt isn't a whole lot of fun to run on, but i've never had anything irritate my skin. after all, there is at least a-little-bit-thick skin that it has to get through. conceivably, it can be troublesome in that you can have saltwater puddles that are below freezing but still soak you. but, i'm not sure how much worse that is that stepping in a normal puddle at freezing is to begin with.

concerning the seri boot thing: i think it is helpful, roughly as you outlined. sure, if you want to develop cold tolerance, you should probably be cold sometimes. :) but, the baked feet do two things. most importantly, you will hopefully get thicker skin which then transfers heat less (out of you, into the snow/ice/road) and protects against pokies and chemicals more. second, while you are doing the baking, you will definitely have more blood pumping through your feet in an effort to keep the temperature under control. whether that results in overall better circulation or more/better blood vessels, who knows. still, for a few minutes, at least, the clean up crew and stuff will be moving around down there. and if you bake for a little bit, a little bit before you go out, you already have the blood vessels opened up and warm and pumping. my experience has been that they then stay open and keep things warm rather than the usual panicking that takes 4 miles to convince them to open back up again.

concerning greasy/mess/cleanup: well, no, you can't have it all. you want to keep the goo on the tops/sides (the back never seems to get cold...) and leave just enough room that it doesn't get on the floor while you're sneaking out the door. curling your toes toward the ceiling for a more duck-like gait helps on expensive carpets. :) and it does tend to collect detritus during the course of your run. this means that when it's 10F and you turn that corner from a 10mph crosswind to a 20mph headwind, you *will* get some grit and goo on the inside of your backup shoes (although you can mitigate this some by bringing a washcloth with you or something to get rid of the major portion; or socks, i suppose). when you get back, paper towels are pretty handy. due to this, i usually only do it to extend the extreme lower end of temperature and wind before going straight to the moccasins from the get-go. i guess it helps a little with snow, but it isn't going to work miracles. to review: a) apply as close to the door as your small children will allow AFTER getting all your other stuff on/ready (maybe even crack the door open in case your fingers get greasy), b) prestage a junky towel and/or paper towels at the door for your return, c) plan ahead so as to not screw up your backup shoes, d) waddle like a duck with your toes pointed to the sky until you get out the door.
 
No problem, I had kinda forgotten about it. I should've contacted her myself.

The more I think about it though, the more I wonder if I would actually run with any of this stuff on. I mean, how do you get out the door without smearing it everywhere? And then when you get home or back to your car, you have to clean up, right? But it's definitely an intriguing idea to wear non-footwear protection against the cold. It might extend my tolerances a bit and help me get my fix of plantar stimulation. It would be really great if it protected against salt, as I intend to run down by the river a lot this winter, and they salt some stretches there.

We're excited to hear your review when it arrives Lee. I hope it will not be as greasy as you think
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We're excited to hear your review when it arrives Lee. I hope it will not be as greasy as you think
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I was thinking more about the jelly Paul.

Paraganek/Darkand, that's hilarious. I run pretty early in the morning, but I'd still be a bit leery about putting on a canine aphrodisiac. And I wonder what effect it might have on the odd raccoon down by the river. Good thing there are no crazy nastya$$ honey badgers around--I doubt even pepper spray works on them.
 
Wow. Even in the Marines I never did runs this cold. I was stationed in the Mojave desert (29 palms), so, rarely did it ever get as cold as here in northern Illinois. Already, this seems to be proving quite the cold year! Especially for those of us in this Winter Challenge!

I gotta admit, I'm loving it! Awesome and brutal. I just finished a little 3.7 mile run with a windchill (RealFeel according to accuweather.com) of 2° Fahrenheit. It's fun when people look at you like you're crazy as you run past them. I'm glad I found the BRS. Makes running more involved on multiple layers.
 
I was thinking more about the jelly

Yea, I can imagine that could be a bit messy when you get home. I use a tiny blob of Vaseline on a piercing I have when I go swimming. It takes ages to get it all off in the shower after :(
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I gotta admit, I'm loving it! Awesome and brutal. I just finished a little 3.7 mile run with a windchill (RealFeel according to accuweather.com) of 2° Fahrenheit. It's fun when people look at you like you're crazy as you run past them. I'm glad I found the BRS. Makes running more involved on multiple layers.

Great job Straif. :coldfeet:
 
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Well I confess today was my first shod day since last winter. It was a few degrees cooler than I had run plus 10-20 mph wind. My house made the wind chill seem really bad (slightly raised and across large open fields) but the bike path is much more sheltered. I dare say I would have tried barefoot had it not been for the snow & ice. Even with shoes it was really rough and lumpy to run on. Might try a short bf run tomorrow on the road, if its not too windy. And as soon as I dig out my electric skillet thingy, going to try the sand bake.